Prime Minister Kyriakos Mitsotakis sent a clear message to Ankara and Turkish leader Recep Tayyip Erdoğan was sent by Prime Minister Kyriakos Mitsotakis during his discussion with the president of the World Economic Forum, Børge Brende, in Davos, Switzerland.
«»If President Erdoğan believes that I will not defend Greece’s sovereignty and sovereign rights and will not point out to the international community that Turkey is acting as a revisionist power, then he is mistaken,‘ Mr. Mitsotakis emphasized, referring to the Turkish President’s recent statements as well as Ankara’s provocations.
The Greek prime minister emphasized that in March 2020, when Turkey attempted to exploit the migration crisis by sending tens of thousands of desperate people to cross the Greek border «we said “no,” we defended Greece’s borders, and we brought European Union leaders to the Greek-Turkish border. At the time, President Erdoğan was saying the same things: that he didn’t want to talk to me. So, maybe he’ll change his mind.».
He noted that we are neighbors and must always talk to one another, and that we always want to keep the lines of communication open.
Mr. Mitsotakis spoke in favor of open channels of communication with Turkey and emphasized that «we will never be the ones who refuse to talk to our neighbors.».
He condemned Turkish aggression and noted that one month after his meeting with Mr. Erdoğan, we saw an unprecedented number of overflights over the Greek islands. «This behavior is completely unacceptable. And I will raise this issue wherever I can until Turkey changes its behavior,» said Mr. Mitsotakis.
Referring to the issue of overflights, he said that it has existed for many years now and added that many politicians in Sweden and Finland now realize how problematic this behavior is.
He made it clear that he supports Finland and Sweden’s accession to NATO, and stated that it would be a mistake for Turkey to continue using these negotiations to gain some kind of advantage for its own national interests.
«This is a time when we must all stand united. It is important that NATO is set to be strengthened by the accession of two additional countries. And frankly, the last thing we need right now in NATO is yet another source of geopolitical instability in the Eastern Mediterranean. That is why it is important to have a period of calm and stability. ’But we were never the ones causing tensions,» said Mr. Mitsotakis.
«We've Succeeded in the Economy»
The prime minister spoke at length about the country’s economic situation and growth, and said that as we approach 2023—which he described as «the year we have elections»—he will tell the people that «we’ve succeeded, and we’ve kept our promises.».
«If you compare Greece ten years ago, in 2012, with Greece in 2022, today we are a confident, resilient country. We fought populism; we defeated populist rhetoric because we proved that we can do things much better,» he emphasized.
Mr. Mitsotakis also said that the government had created jobs, increased disposable income, and raised the minimum wage by 10%, while noting:
«We recognize that wages are still low in Greece. We want to ensure that the growth we are generating is growth that reduces income inequality. This issue concerns me deeply. We cannot continue to tell our young people that they will have a worse life than their parents. And if we don’t offer young people the opportunity to participate in this growth, we’ll end up repeating the mistakes of the past.».
The prime minister expressed hope that Greece would achieve investment-grade status sometime in 2023 and said that this is the final hurdle that must be overcome, and outlined the measures that have contributed to growth and increased investment.
As he said, there was significant support for companies during the pandemic, and jobs were protected, while unemployment stood at 17% when the New Democracy party took office and «will soon be below 12%.».
He added that the more services are digitized, the more transactions are conducted electronically, and the less tax evasion there is, and he referred to the use of technology in combating tax evasion.
Finally, the prime minister expressed his support for renewable energy sources and said that we can and must be leaders in renewable energy and in new technologies related to climate change. In the short term, he said, we must diversify away from Russian natural gas, but we must also be aware of the fact that we are currently under pressure.
«We pay Russia for natural gas at prices that are excessively high. And they do not reflect the fundamental principles of the natural gas market. And that is why I supported the idea of some kind of price cap on the wholesale natural gas market in Europe,» said Mr. Mitsotakis.
He announced that he would resubmit this proposal to the European Council, and that we must «do this, in cooperation, of course, with the Americans, because they are major suppliers of liquefied natural gas (LNG). And they have smart ideas on how we can actually make this happen.» But—he added—«I don’t want us to find ourselves in a situation where we’re spending more and more, subsidizing electricity and natural gas bills domestically, and the European Union won’t support us in this effort. It’s important to invest in the future. And that is why the RePowerEU initiative is, I believe, an excellent addition to NextGenerationEU as a financial tool that will help us invest in the green transition.».
Prime Minister Kyriakos Mitsotakis's discussion with World Economic Forum President Børge Brende in Davos, Switzerland
Børge Brende: Good morning. We welcome Prime Minister Kyriakos Mitsotakis. He has been to the U.S. twice in recent weeks, having returned to Greece in between. It is a great pleasure to have you with us here in Davos. Thank you for your leadership in representing your country. The transformation of the Greek economy is a key issue, and I know that confidence in your country’s economy has returned. And that is no easy feat. Someone had to do this work. And also within the EU, we know that you personally and Greece are once again viewed positively and are regarded as a very important partner in the European Union. And I also know that your recent visits to the U.S. demonstrate a very substantive cooperation between you personally, the Greek Prime Minister, and President Biden, and they demonstrate your leadership in the wake of the war in Ukraine. Let’s first say a few words about the war in Ukraine. How historic is this turning point for Europe and the EU? Our meeting is taking place at a critical historical juncture. Could this change Europe forever?;
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: It is indeed a historic turning point, and I believe that an entire era—which essentially began in 1990 with the collapse of communism—is clearly drawing to a close. It has already changed Europe. Europe has proven to be exceptionally united and has very quickly imposed unprecedented sanctions on Russia. It has revitalized transatlantic relations. It has given NATO a new purpose. And it is also pushing Europe to think much more strategically about the concept of strategic autonomy, of which I was a strong advocate even before Russia’s invasion of Ukraine. If you look at the energy sector, for example, we were already the most ambitious continent in terms of the goal of achieving climate neutrality by 2050. Now we have an additional reason to do so, and that is to reduce our dependence on Russian hydrocarbons as quickly as possible. We must therefore focus more on renewable energy sources. In the short term, we need to diversify our sources of hydrocarbon supply. And Greece has a very important role to play in this process, given that we are a key partner in the Eastern Mediterranean. And the Eastern Mediterranean is a region of strategic interest to both Europe and the United States.
Børge Brende: So, Mr. Prime Minister, your visit to Washington was historic. I don’t know when was the last time a Greek prime minister addressed a joint session of the U.S. Congress.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Never. It was my first time, and it was certainly an honor for me—an honor for my country. As you know, addresses like this, before a joint session of Congress, do not happen very often. But it was an opportunity for me, first and foremost, to honor the histories of our two democracies, to speak about the past, about the influence of the Athenian Democracy on the founding —the Founding Fathers of the American Revolution—as well as the influence America had on our own Struggle for Independence. Of course, we also spoke at length about the present and the future. We have a very strong strategic partnership with the United States, which is not focused solely on the defense sector. It also extends to energy. For example, the Port of Alexandroupolis in northeastern Greece is taking on great strategic importance for the diversification of energy supplies, not only for Greece but also for the Balkans. If we want to replace Russian gas in the Balkans, the easiest way to do so is to bring liquefied natural gas (LNG) to Northern Greece and then distribute it to the Balkan markets. And, of course, the trip to the U.S. also focused on bilateral economic cooperation between our countries.
It was an opportunity for me to explain how much Greece has changed over the past three years, to argue that the Greece many people remembered—the Greece of «huge deficits»— the Greece that was essentially under some form of bailout-imposed control, no longer exists. And it was funny because when I went to Washington to meet with President Trump in January 2020, we were still discussing when and how I should visit the IMF. Now, there has been no discussion of my visit to the IMF. It was unnecessary because Greece has repaid its loans to the IMF two years ahead of schedule. So perhaps this is the best indication of just how much the country has truly changed in recent years.
Børge Brende: How was this economic miracle achieved so quickly? It was said that it would take decades for the Greek economy to truly recover. What measures were taken, and how was this recovery accelerated so dramatically?;
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: First and foremost, we implemented a drastic policy change. We have always maintained that the previous government had overtaxed the real economy. And the more you tax the real economy, the more you stifle growth. Our job was to put Greece on a path to high growth, and to do so primarily through investment—both domestic and foreign. And on that front, we succeeded. I was looking at the latest OECD data, which show that Greece has seen the largest reduction in the tax burden on wages among OECD countries in recent years. But we achieved this without jeopardizing the sustainability of our fiscal path, as the economy is growing much faster than we expected. This brings in more revenue for the national budget. At the same time, we have completely overhauled the regulatory framework in Greece and digitized government services. In this way, we have reduced bureaucracy. Greeks are pleased that they can now access government services via their cell phones or computers, instead of standing in lines and being burdened by Greek bureaucracy. S&P upgraded the Greek economy a month ago, even after the invasion of Ukraine. And in August, we’ll be done with enhanced surveillance. It’s a very important milestone. The decision has been made.
And we hope that Greece will achieve investment-grade status sometime in 2023. And that is the last hurdle we need to overcome! No one is worried about Greece right now. If you compare Greece ten years ago, in 2012, with Greece in 2022, today we are a confident country, a resilient country. We fought populism; we defeated populist rhetoric because we proved that we can do things much better.
And as we approach 2023—an election year—this is what we will tell the Greek people: that we succeeded. We kept our promises. We’ve created jobs. We’ve increased disposable income. We’ve raised the minimum wage by 10%. We recognize that wages are still low in Greece. We want to ensure that the growth we’re creating is growth that reduces income inequality. This issue concerns me deeply. We cannot continue to tell our young people that they will have a worse life than their parents. And if we do not offer young people the opportunity to participate in this growth, we will end up repeating the mistakes of the past.
Børge Brende: So you’ve succeeded in reducing the taxes that were hindering growth, investment, and creditworthiness. And you want to ensure that wealth is redistributed to the most vulnerable. Speaking of tax cuts, one of the challenges—at least in the past—was that taxes existed but weren’t being paid. Is it now better understood—with a more competitive tax system—that taxes must at least be paid?;
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Two points on this. That’s interesting. We provided businesses with significant support during the pandemic. And I think we did it the right way. Because our top priority was to protect jobs. And we succeeded. Unemployment was 17% when we took office. Very soon it will be below 12%. But the way we did it was by examining companies’ reported revenues. So, companies that evaded taxes didn’t receive government aid. And when they complained, we told them, «Tough luck.» Perhaps this is a lesson for the future. At the same time, the more services we digitize, the more transactions take place electronically, and the less tax evasion there is. One of the major reforms of the past decade has been that our tax authority is now completely independent. We have much better expertise. We use technology much more effectively to identify those who evade taxes. This allows us to increase public revenue and combat tax evasion, which has always been a major problem in Greece.
Børge Brende: And to get back to regional and global politics, you went to Washington and also met with President Biden. But I just read in the news that your neighbor, President Erdogan, doesn’t want to answer the phone when you call him.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: I remember March 2020, when Turkey tried to exploit the migration crisis by sending tens of thousands of desperate people to cross the Greek border, we said «no,» defended Greece’s borders, and brought European Union leaders to the Greek-Turkish border. Back then, President Erdoğan was saying the same things: that he didn’t want to talk to me. So, perhaps he’ll change his mind.
At the end of the day, we’re neighbors. We must always talk, and we always want to keep the lines of communication open. We will never be the ones to refuse to talk to our neighbors. On the other hand, if President Erdoğan believes that I will not defend Greece’s sovereignty and sovereign rights and will not point out to the international community that Turkey is acting as aaggressive power, then he is mistaken. Because what have we seen, unfortunately, over the past two months? I went to Istanbul and met with President Erdogan. I thought it was a good meeting, but a month later we saw an unprecedented number of overflights over the Greek islands. This behavior is completely unacceptable. And I will raise this issue wherever I can until Turkey changes its behavior.
Børge Brende: But there were serious consequences when the Russians flew over Turkey, weren't there?;
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: We have been dealing with the issue of overflights for many years now. Many of our colleagues in Sweden and Finland understand just how problematic this behavior is. And speaking of Finland and Sweden, I want to be absolutely clear. We have clearly supported their accession to NATO from the very beginning. And I believe it is wrong for Turkey to continue using these negotiations to gain some kind of advantage for its own national interest. This is a time when we must all stand united. It is important that NATO is set to be strengthened by the accession of two additional countries. And frankly, the last thing we need right now in NATO is yet another source of geopolitical instability in the Eastern Mediterranean. That is why it is important to have a period of calm and stability. But we were never the ones causing tensions.
Børge Brende: I think you were in Washington at almost the same time as the Swedish prime minister.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Yes, I was there two days before the Prime Minister of Sweden and the President of Finland.
Børge Brende: You have also spoken about Europe’s role following the war in Ukraine. I just heard Prime Minister Rutte speak at another meeting, where he said that Europe cannot remain «the playing field.» We need to start becoming the players ourselves, and Europe must stand as a power alongside China and the U.S.—we are the largest market in the world. Do you agree with that?;
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Yes, I agree, but we also need to think carefully about what that means. When it comes to defense, we need to do more. As I told you, we supported the concept of European strategic autonomy even before the Ukraine crisis. We need to spend more, but we also need to spend more wisely. We need to review our defense systems and achieve greater interoperability. The defense industry in Europe is, frankly, very fragmented at the moment, and there will be times when Europe will need to act on its own, possibly without NATO’s involvement. NATO will always be the cornerstone of transatlantic stability and is the most successful alliance in the world. And if we strengthen our strategic autonomy, we also strengthen NATO. The more we invest in our defense capabilities, the more resources we make available to NATO. But we must also look at what we have done with regard to the Strategic Compass, which is an important document, and recognize that we will have our own interests as the European Union. And I believe that energy, of course, will be the critical «battleground» in the short term. In the medium and long term, we can be leaders in the energy transition.
We can be leaders. We must be leaders in renewable energy. We should be leaders in new technologies related to climate change. In the short term, we need to diversify away from Russian natural gas, but we must also be aware that we are currently under pressure. We are paying Russia for natural gas at prices that are excessively high. And they do not reflect the fundamental principles of the natural gas market. And that is why I supported the idea of some kind of price cap on the wholesale natural gas market in Europe.
And I will bring this proposal back to the European Council. We must do this, in cooperation, of course, with the Americans, because they are major suppliers of liquefied natural gas (LNG). And they have smart ideas on how we can actually make this happen. But I don’t want us to end up in a situation where we’re spending more and more, subsidizing electricity and natural gas bills domestically, while the European Union does not support us in this effort. It is important to invest in the future. And that is why the RePowerEU initiative is, I believe, an excellent addition to NextGenerationEU as a financial tool that will help us invest in the green transition.
But we also need to consider what we will do tomorrow, next month, and over the next three months. What will we do this winter to support our citizens? We have put together what I believe is a very robust domestic package of measures to support households and businesses with regard to electricity prices. But frankly, Europe needs to do more in this area.
Børge Brende: But that would mean Europe would have to shut down quite a few industrial plants—aluminum, fertilizer, etc.—if there’s no electricity there, I suppose.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Of course, we need to prepare for the worst-case scenario, but what you described is quite a dramatic turn of events. Because we use natural gas for three reasons: we use gas in industry, and we use gas for heating. This will be very important in the winter. And we use gas to generate electricity. In Greece, we consume more natural gas in the summer than in the winter, simply because demand is higher due to air conditioning.
Børge Brende: I’m also thinking, however, about the enormous business opportunities associated with the green transition. I believe there is still enormous potential when it comes to what are known as «freedom fuels,» that is, new renewable energy sources. But, as you said, Mr. Prime Minister, we must also prepare for the short and medium term. Nothing is built overnight.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: You’re right to point out that renewable energy sources are currently the cheapest form of energy we can produce. Perhaps for the first time in Greece, we managed, on a day in April—it was a sunny, windy day with relatively low energy consumption—to generate electricity entirely from wind and solar power. This is the future, and we will expand our capacity in renewable energy. However, we must also speed up the permitting process. It cannot take five years to build a wind farm or a solar power plant.
And that is why European initiatives aimed at streamlining the permitting process are so important, the idea of shifting focus to areas where you can actually go and build renewable energy capacity at a much faster pace.
But that alone won’t be effective. We need storage and storage technologies. We really need to invest in storage technologies. We can look at pumped-storage hydroelectricity. Countries like Greece—which can support such a system due to their geography—are utilizing significant funds from the Recovery and Resilience Facility to build the first pumped-storage power plants. Of course, batteries, and then power grids. Our grids are currently unable to support the integration of renewable energy sources and their interconnection (with the system).
We want to build a power cable connecting Greece and Egypt. It will be a 3-gigawatt power cable. This is very important because it will allow us to bring very affordable solar electricity generated in Egypt to European markets. Therefore, if we want to have a European market that functions properly, we must do all of these things.
And we need to focus on energy conservation as well, because even very small changes in our habits, if adopted by all European consumers, will truly make a difference. And sometimes, there’s skepticism when we talk about energy conservation. If you tell people, «You could turn up the temperature on your air conditioner by one or two degrees,» it really does make a big difference. They’ll end up paying lower bills.
For example, we are launching a program now to provide subsidies for the replacement of old air conditioning units in homes and businesses. The new units are 50% and 60%, which are more energy-efficient. I would therefore like us to place greater emphasis on ensuring that we use less energy than we currently do at the European level.
Børge Brende: Thank you very much for that response. I also heard you speaking about energy last night. And I think it’s very reassuring to know that we have leaders in Europe who are knowledgeable about this sector. It’s a complex field.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: None of us knew much about energy before we took office. But the energy market is a complex issue. Every country has different priorities. But I really urge my colleagues to look at the big picture right now. We did it with COVID. We did it with the NextGenerationEU program. We did it with the vaccines. We’re doing it with the REPowerEU plan. But let’s also look at the short-term problem we’re facing, because we may have a difficult winter ahead of us.
Børge Brende: Let’s move on to some other topics. But if we consider the energy situation Europe finds itself in now—40% of natural gas came and continues to come from Russia—in hindsight, how big a mistake was it to put so many eggs in the Kremlin’s basket? When we saw what happened in Georgia, when we saw what happened in Crimea—we saw all of that and took a huge risk. In fact, NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg said yesterday that we had prioritized the economy, when we should have prioritized freedom and independence.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Yes, that’s true. And looking back, (I believe) it was a mistake. But we mustn’t forget that for many European countries—especially the major producing countries— having access to very cheap Russian natural gas made all the difference in terms of their competitiveness. And what we also know now is that we weren’t all paying the same price for the same amount of gas. At least if we had all paid the same price, we could argue that we all reaped the same benefit. But that is not the case. That is why it is truly important that these decisions be made at the European level.
Børge Brende: Returning to the geopolitical role of Europe and the EU, you said that Europe must take greater responsibility for its own security. 80% of NATO’s military capabilities comes from countries outside the EU.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Greece has been spending more than 2% of its GDP on defense for quite some time now, as we have legitimate concerns about our security. Therefore, the first thing we need to do is ensure that we increase our overall level of defense spending. But this needs to be done in a smarter way.
And there are areas where it is clear that we can work together. And we must do so at the European level in order to increase our capabilities. Cyberspace, for example, is one such area. Space is another area where it makes no sense for a medium-sized country like Greece to invest on its own.
Therefore, what you are describing is a reality. And for that reason, NATO will continue to be very important. But if at some point we need to make a decision at the European level, we must be able to put it into practice. And of course, there are other issues related to our security. I’d like to mention one of them: border management. This issue is very important. We cannot have a Schengen Area that functions properly unless we ensure that we control who enters and who leaves the European Union. We have done so, and indeed with the utmost respect for human rights.
But we are defending our borders, and we want to ensure that we tackle the criminal gangs of illegal traffickers who profit from human suffering and hardship. What we want is organized immigration. There is a labor shortage in Europe. There is a labor shortage in Greece, with unemployment at 12%. Therefore, if, for example, we need workers for agriculture or the construction sector and we can get them, then let’s enter into organized agreements with other countries, rather than encouraging people to cross the Aegean under these tragic and dangerous conditions. And this is a crucial point for our security. We don’t discuss it enough. But I can tell you that, as a country on the EU’s border, this issue is of great concern to us.
Børge Brende: You saw this situation unfold at the border between Belarus and Poland as well.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Yes, because others set the rules of the game there. And we’ve seen how dangerous it is to exploit migrants and refugees for geopolitical purposes. And we cannot allow something like that to happen again.
Børge Brende: As this conversation comes to a close, I wish we had more time to talk about European values and also about the «journey» Greece has been on. When it joined the European Union, perhaps not everything was perfect. But the European Union wanted to integrate Spain, Portugal, and Greece, and it did so very successfully. I know that these countries are leaders. And as you mentioned, Mr. Prime Minister, Greece’s journey has been toward a true democracy. It has been very difficult over the past ten years. There are challenges in the EU’s neighborhood, but there are also conflicts within the EU itself, as not all EU countries adhere to the Union’s fundamental agreements and principles. Do you believe that those who seemed very satisfied and had become complacent need to be more rigorous in the coming years?;
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: First of all, the European Union has helped transform Greece. Since we joined, we have benefited greatly economically. But at some point, we became complacent and paid a very heavy price.
But Greece remained in the Eurozone, and that was the right decision. And now we’re very pleased that things are going quite well for us again. But European values and democratic values are part of who we are as a country.
And that is why the concept of reinventing democracy in the 21st century is so important. And that is why there can be no compromises on issues of the rule of law and adherence to the acquis communautaire.
Ultimately, this defines who we are. It is what we committed to when we became members of the European Union. At the same time, we must acknowledge that many of the concerns that fuel populism and poison public discourse are legitimate concerns.
Income inequality is a huge issue. We cannot afford to ignore it. And that is why, when we think about Greece’s long-term growth, we do not want to repeat the mistakes of the past.
We want inclusive, non-exclusionary development, and we also need to examine how we engage in political debate in the public sphere. How can we reduce toxicity? We play a leading role in regulating the digital ecosystem, but we can do more to collaborate with major tech companies to ensure that hate speech, misinformation, and misinformation do not become part of the online dialogue. Because, unfortunately, that is what we have to deal with. And one final observation. If political discourse is so toxic, if it’s all about personal attacks, think about the next generation of leaders. Who will want to enter politics if they have to endure all of this, if they have to face character assassinations? We truly risk sending the next generation of leaders the message that it’s not worth getting involved in politics. Because the price they’ll be called upon to pay will be very high.
Børge Brende: Thank you very much, Prime Minister. So, no compromise on our core values. And thank you again for your leadership, the recovery of the Greek economy—which also strengthens Greece’s position in the European Union and in Europe—as well as for your historic address to both Houses of Congress. I am grateful for this wonderful discussion.
Kyriakos Mitsotakis: Thank you.
